Mission: Trackball

[vib_ribbon]

i dont have the room for dedicated cabs, so i enjoy the small scale projects that lead me to modify the odd control panel or 2...

http://www.geocities.com/prawdad/mame/Panele.jpg

oops, sorry - that's not the photo i wanted to show you... :sad:

ah...here's the proper photos...
so i do stuff like this...
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1220/623334765_d0087e7c6a.jpg

and stuff like this...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2361/1805775914_cf47ee3706.jpg

all very simple stuff which i am capable of. :tongue:

recently, i wanted to play some trackball games, but i knew diddly squat about trackballs so i asked arcadefever for his expert tutorlage.

not only was he nice enough to run me through the basics, he even sent me a spare trackball that he had!!

...so this is where the story begins. i received the package on friday and before i get distracted by the newspaper clippings in the box used as packing...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3161/2333056957_3de720904f.jpg

i looked at the trackball... uhm... too impatient to locate a socket that will go into this plug...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2417/2333861752_1948f05888.jpg

solution?? sorry fred. :sad:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3121/2333865018_75f4d21e75.jpg

i was very rushed for time, but didnt want to leave this hanging in the balance, i wanted to know if the gameboard works so i can plan ahead and buy all the other bits for this project... so... this will have to do... :sad:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3131/2333041419_138ced877f.jpg

the moment of truth!! trackball on 1 stool, game board on the other...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2325/2333871178_90504f2ce0.jpg

i'm bashing the trackball with one hand, holding the camera in the other.... (oo-er), look ma, i'm running... and i'm running!!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2253/2333874282_b6ca853f3d.jpg

the trackball's on the verge of falling off the stool, i'm so engrossed that i'm still running and taking photos!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2415/2333877486_f22825975c.jpg

i just miss the finish line... and then, a flash back from 15/20 years back, something i had forgotten about! the chin up penalty!! give me 10 chin ups, soldier!!!!!!!!!!!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2406/2333880498_53b5ecdc7b.jpg

that's when i realised i had only hooked up the controls for left and right, and not up and down.... :sad::sad::sad:

okay, no more fun, back to work... lets check out how this is gonna fit into the control panel housing... looks like the way it's gonna be aligned, it's gonna intersect one of the vertical panels. more grinding needed.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2068/2333059797_4b633f0ac4.jpg

is it gonna be deep enough to fit?? it looks like it. a comparison with the spinner, they are roughly the same depth, but of course the trackball takes up a wider area.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2159/2333062841_2fae9ee800.jpg

i'm still thinking about how i'm gonna mount the thing. i dont really want to use the 4 bolts supplied cos that means i'll have to punch 4 further holes in the panel (which i dont have a hole punch for - these are square holes not round ones). besides, i dont want to get caught on the bolts by accident when i go crazy on combat school... perhaps i can shape the insides of the housing and create some sort of a tray for the trackball to sit on?? anyway, we'll cross that bridge when we get there!!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3283/2333065887_9a399fee8b.jpg

so far so good... next step, buy the hole punch!! it's not as expensive as i thought, as i need a 55mm one.

thanks fred for the trackball and all the help so far. will need more help later no doubt! :cool:

[Mr-Megalo]

so far so good !
Fred did a bit of restoration on the trackball too didn't he and replaced some bits internally

[vib_ribbon]

indeed he did. he's trying to pursuade me to get Cabal after i get the trackball work. i'm pretty much sold on the idea, but to say that it's better than Nam 75, i'd be the judge of that. :wink:

[SuperPang]

One word (or maybe two) - SegaSonic

I keep meaning to pick up a trackball just for this

Theres a set on YJ but the price is too high as is usual with that seller

[joeblade]

I still love that spinner cp for arkanoid...:cool::cool:

[vib_ribbon]

anyone ever seen the connector that's on the end of the combat school board for the trackball attachment?? i never like to hard solder stuff onto the boards, so unless i can find the correct connector, i'm gonna need to fabricate something nasty...

[Neo Gold]

Good work Vib!!:cool:...i loved Arkanoid & Revenge of Doh too...:smile:
Btw...How close is this ??..:wink:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HPv5xwNxsQ

[vib_ribbon]

Good work Vib!!:cool:...i loved Arkanoid & Revenge of Doh too...:smile:
Btw...How close is this ??..:wink:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HPv5xwNxsQ

how close? as in how accurate?? i wouldnt know, i cant even get pass level 1 at the moment... :sad: soon though, i'd be able to tell you hopefully. i know that the arcade version has speech that the 8 bit conversions didnt...

ah...i found the arcade version on youtube!
4KPfv8zG43s

[vib_ribbon]

i am told that the connector i need is a standard .156 molex (10 pin) connector.

anyone know any UK suppliers that might carry this connector? sorry, i'm not so clued up on the suppliers.

[arcadefever]

so far so good !
Fred did a bit of restoration on the trackball too didn't he and replaced some bits internally

I had to change some parts (roller) the TB was in very bad shape :sick:

more pictures here:

http://spaceinvaders.7.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=985


Can not wait to see it on the panel :wink:

[Mr-Megalo]

@ Vib have you tried swallowamusements ?

@ fred, yea i've seen the little rebuild on the trackball, very impressive

[vib_ribbon]

@ Vib have you tried swallowamusements ?


yeah, that's where i'm looking at the moment. with the help of someone over on byoac combined with j+, i might actually have pinpointed the parts i need on swallow.

it's the mounting of the trackball that's gonna be tricky... i have some ideas, but won't know until i spend some more time studying it in my hands.

[vib_ribbon]

okay! some continuation of this project...

i've taken it up the pooper and ordered the 7 pound allen key, so i am waiting for that to turn up.

in the mean time, i got cracking with the rest of the stuff.

throughout the week, i have been toying with the control panel and the trackball together on their own... everything gradually became clear in my mind what i had to do next, but it wasnt until i put the panel back into the cab did those ideas go out of the window...

i had marked where i think the trackball would align with the panel...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2313/2349453845_eeeb7d1633.jpg

but because of the plastics that the panel sits on top of means a good couple of centimetres are shaved off the panel itself... and other bits of plastics in the surround being in the way, there was no way the trackball would fit where its intended...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2190/2349457555_3e94b7c6f6.jpg

i thought i was fooked!! all the money, time and effort to get this project to work has gone to waste... then i had a thought... i got the calipers out...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2009/2349461145_38896e745c.jpg

measured it up against the trackball...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3154/2349464219_7c3b6696b3.jpg

got the junior hacksaw out and started hacking chunks off the trackball. i thought i heard the distant voice of arcadefever at this stage going, "noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!"
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3218/2349468211_e8422cb03e.jpg

i took a strip off the trackball like so
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2377/2349472117_b4e8fb7aaf.jpg

there was also another bit on the surround that needed some attention... i coloured it red in this pic.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3002/2350309130_f47ecb6489.jpg

i unscrewed the whole surround and started hacking that off too... i wonder if anyone would buy this cab off me in the future??
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2135/2349479629_9c8a45bbef.jpg

well, it was all or nothing now... got the drill out and put 4 holes into the trackball where the mounting is gonna be
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3073/2349483933_0f192e7250.jpg

you can see the idea in this pic why i had to cut a strip out of the trackball and how the bolts of the existing mounting plate comes into the trackball and secured on. i'm just hoping that my calculations are correct and the innards of the trackball wont collide into those screws
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2259/2350320510_b9f56f92cc.jpg

looks like i need to do the same on this side as well. the trackball has to be flush with the panel else it will be crappy
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2323/2349490965_8305e9498a.jpg

i ran out of time so i just put everything back together minus the ball to see what else needs doing...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3295/2350327272_14fc94e8c3.jpg

looking to one side, at least i got the correct connectors for the board! :wub:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2074/2350330996_e51c481bfc.jpg


to be continued....

[Mr-Megalo]

me and JoeBlade were discussing your panels and such today, we think your great at this stuff and actually love them, so what if you have to make minor modifications to the cabs or casings, they are neat and they serve there purpose for you.

btw, I was playing Combat School shortly after this conversation

me and Joe both agree you need to bite the bullet and pick up a Ghouls N Ghosts even if it does cost you more than £100 though,

oh and yes, I would buy that cab off of you in the future, the slight modification you have done in no way affects the structural integrity of the cab or the CP

[vib_ribbon]

continue!!

lemme high light this bit which concerns me... it's a guide for the pcb inside the trackball... it's overlapping the area that needs to get the chop!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2381/2355048621_e1607d0aab.jpg

i did think about it... perhaps i can cut the pcb??
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3125/2355886532_7db91159f7.jpg

i went ahead and cut the strip as close to the pcb guide as possible without actually taking it away.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2182/2355891338_249ffbe1ef.jpg

after much filing to take the cut down further, i realised that unless i re-do the holes for the bolts, i'm not gonna to get this thing to fit!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2218/2355895934_95302fd467.jpg

and then i forgot to take that photo, and the photo for me judging how much of the insides of the cab i need to take off...

here's me starting the grinder already!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2145/2355066959_3647566b8a.jpg

would this be enough...? (didnt cut very straight this time!)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2102/2355071665_417259425f.jpg

it shuts!!!!
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3010/2355076847_9fe98effca.jpg

now all i need is to punch the hole for the ball!! :mellow: but i already see another handful of problems that need to be resolved.

[vib_ribbon]

me and Joe both agree you need to bite the bullet and pick up a Ghouls N Ghosts even if it does cost you more than £100 though,

if i do that it would need to be from a very good seller... not gonna risk the board turning up DOA.

[vib_ribbon]

why does an allen key cost 7 quid??

that's when it's the size of a crowbar!

i now have all my bits... just waiting to get turning that hole cutter.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3276/2363240297_b87410bb39.jpg

[vib_ribbon]

okay... with the football out of the way, i could dedicate some more time to this before next wednesday!

first of all... i noticed that i had read the measurements of the diameter of the trackball wrong! i was off by 2mm (d'oh!!)... so i had to do some filing... everytime i do something like this, i can hear fred's voice in my head, "what are you doing?!?!?" :h: so what i thought was 55mm, it was actually 57mm!! so i filed down the rim, which was easy enough luckily.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2006/2383844032_f9933c3ccb.jpg

okay, lets not slip up anymore and mark down some guide lines!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2373/2383846822_a939b7045f.jpg

i needed a bit more space so i moved to another room in the house... i attached the vice onto the table... okay, everything's now set!!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2225/2383849586_c4c658ff69.jpg

lets just double check the other side, people!! all looks well!
and yes, i did decide to put the cutter on this side instead of the other...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3156/2383852986_c95117fb91.jpg

i clamped the cutter in the vice and balanced the control panel on some video cassettes... here goes nothing......
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3083/2383856202_8b0ab9c3f4.jpg

indeed it was "here goes nothing"... as the vice cannot be secured to the table tight enough... the physical force required to cut into the panel meant that the vice kept shifting...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2147/2383859452_5fde21b9e4.jpg

okay, plan B... get it down on the floor...
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2204/2383862398_99ac8e38af.jpg

alright, my palm's starting to ache... get some gloves on and try again... :|
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3119/2383035547_35ce51cabe.jpg

grrrr....!! that's no good. it was like Homer trying to build his BBQ unit... how would Darth Nuno do this if it was him??
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2186/2383868482_1bb003eb4f.jpg

to be continued...

[vib_ribbon]

continue...

i did consider giving up for the night, but at the same time i wanted to see how bad it looked and maybe i could straighten it by putting it back into the housing and tighten the screws... this is the gap left by the twist in the panel.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2408/2383871302_65408bb6c8.jpg

TIP!! - This is what I didnt know and with hindsight should have done. I should have left the panel in the housing when I started cutting!! It keeps the panel straight. And although there were points where I thought I could snap the screws with the force that was being exerted, they held up!!

Progress!!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2100/2383874286_60b322cf50.jpg

...as the teeth went into the panel, it just got tougher and tougher. I was virtually putting my entire body weight down on the allen key and it wasnt budging... :? Change of tactic (out of frustration... kick the motherf*****!)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2299/2383046981_d872065aa6.jpg

..of course, that was a stupid idea... so I went back to the brute force of leaning my entire body weight into it...

...as the chinese saying goes, if you have the patience, you can grind a metal rod down to a pin... so that's what happened! it took over an hour...and it's breakthrough time!!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2240/2383880664_afcc47dcfd.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3187/2383053505_b76741a7e0.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2007/2383886944_b4057b083e.jpg

now my hand has a blister and my other arm has a few bruises... and because the panel is twisted, the trackball no longer mounts on it, so it will need to be straightened again somehow.

:sad::sad::sad:

soon, i hope...:dry:

:vinkko:

[joeblade]

I take my hat off to ya vib, with a LOT of patience you got there in the end buddy!! :smile::smile:

This is exactly the reason why i would never try this shiz myself.....i'd just make a complete f***king mess of it....then probably THROW the cp across the room!! :laugh::laugh:

Im really looking foward to seeing this finished now, hopefully it will have been worth all the hassle!! :wink:

[penrhos]

I bent a few CP's so now i clamp them lenghtways in my workbench to prevent it.

[vib_ribbon]

ideally, the cutter segment needed to be clamped which i failed to do so the panel doesnt risk getting bent. i went outside looking for a crack in the pavement or something that i could wedge it between so it doesnt move, but couldnt find anything suitable.

it's hammer time now.

[vib_ribbon]

I bent a few CP's so now i clamp them lenghtways in my workbench to prevent it.

any tip on how to unbend the panel? it's the twist around the hole punched area that is gonna be the main problem. i dont have a rubber mallet, so i was just gonna put some cloth over that area and use a metal hammer and give it some.

[cools]

With the amount of force you needed to use I'd be amazed if you got away without bending it at all in some direction - even clamped along the whole length. Holesaw/tank cutter would've made it a lot easier!

Metal hammer on the underside will be fine, it'll make a mess of the overlay if you try it topside - even with a cloth buffer...

[vib_ribbon]

With the amount of force you needed to use I'd be amazed if you got away without bending it at all in some direction - even clamped along the whole length.

that's what i was trying to suggest, you shouldnt be clamping the control panel at all, instead, you clamp just the buttom cutter. my tiny little hobby vice couldnt do it because of the force required, that's why i went outside of my door to look for a crack in the pavement or a hole in a metal grid that the cutter can sit into securely for me to start applying the turn. the bottom cutter does have 2 flat sides for this approach to work.

[penrhos]

To unbend a CP I've used a rubber mallet (but it leaves marks)

I find either a vice or workbench and some wood blocks with some rubber or thick plastic to protect the overlay works best.

[vib_ribbon]

so after some hammering, some twisting and bending... it's (sort of) finished(?)
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2249/2396964786_a9442fd9c1.jpg

the panel:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3182/2396133923_717a6eaa3d.jpg

close up. the finish is not great. the ball does feel sunken in the panel a bit, but cant argue, could have been a lot worse!
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2223/2396971336_0b8353b3d5.jpg

the insides... for some reason, the controls were all inverted, so i had to swap all the connections round...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3153/2396974202_9c52031f18.jpg

at least the connector that plugs into the board works perfectly...
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3218/2396977496_553dcd5ac5.jpg

now onto the game.... it's rock 'ard!!! level 3 slaughters me, i dunno how i'm gonna get past it... :bomb1:

[Mr-Megalo]

last time I played Combat School was at JoeB's, seeing it again gives me the urge to fire MAME up and have another go.

[joeblade]

Well done vib, you got there in the end!! :cool:
A good learning experience methinks....:smile:

[vib_ribbon]

Well done vib, you got there in the end!! :cool:
A good learning experience methinks....:smile:

indeed. if anyone else wants to have a go, they can borrow the cutter off me as i doubt i'll have another use for it now. i also find myself rolling the trackball with my right hand rather than left during play.